A couple of people suggested that I stop referring to the sexual orientation of incompetent and corrupt court psychologists. They say that it is a distraction from the great harm being done.
Research shows that you need 10% for a political movement:
"When the number of committed opinion holders is below 10 percent, there is no visible progress in the spread of ideas. It would literally take the amount of time comparable to the age of the universe for this size group to reach the majority," said SCNARC Director Boleslaw Szymanski, the Claire and Roland Schmitt Distinguished Professor at Rensselaer. "Once that number grows above 10 percent, the idea spreads like flame."So we do not need to convince everyone, but we do need to convince at least 10% to be committed to the cause.
I attended a public Occupy Santa Cruz meeting, just to study their organizational structure. That movement has gotten a lot of momentum rapidly. They do not have any coherent goals. Just a conviction that there is a financial elite that is running this country to the disadvantage of the other 99%.
The Occupy movement seems to include college grads complaining about student loan debt. Possibly they would be sympathetic to dads with child support debt.
I have to be at the Watsonville courthouse on Friday morning for my contempt sentencing. I assume that Judge Heather Morse will not actually punish me, since she had to make up new orders during my contempt trial in order to claim that I was violating her orders. I would be happy to join in a protest, but I don't think that we have enough yet.
47 comments:
what 10% would we be targeting? The county's populuation? That'd be 25,000 people.
An easy way to start getting to that population is to post signs or hold rallys w/booths in front of the Watsonville courthouse. Everyone who's going through divorce has to go through those doors of the Josef Stalin Memorial Courthouse (the building is designed architecturally along the lines of the old Soviet large concrete block of oppressive bureacracy, yes?) so handing out leaflets w/real data/info of what's really happening in family law and what we're doing would be a good start. Could set up meetings right across the street in that coffee house.
and btw, good luck w/your hearing on Friday, what time is it?
Lots of passion and interest from most of you. Wish you the best.
People experienced unfair problems will not be even ready to come for protest. Their lives are exhausted and have to meet ends meet.
We need to highlight great cases. Provide compelling stories of crimes committed against children and innocents.
I spoke with many for few years. Many people will say it is not their cup of tea. People currently first time married unaware of crimes of courts, just like some of us during marriage. People who are singles many do not care. People who went through severe problems with courts are mostly incapacitated by courts.
Generally compelling message of cause and promoting it through PR/media/rally/protest. Reaching youth and young will help. Now we have social media to do it easily.
The view of the system towards you is : You're washed out and probably destroyed. You're weakened and have no power. We are not threatened by you. We go to NEXT in line, please.
Until we build grass root fabric for national movement, it will not work easily.
We must highlight important cases. Bring to most people attention. Put videos/documentaries.
Here is one old news from San Jose
Federal Jury in San Jose, CA Awards $3.25 Million in Damages to Family for Unlawful Seizure of Their Children Represented by The Law Offices of Johnson & Johnson
PRWeb
Tuesday, April 5, 2011
Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2011/04/04/prweb8269009.DTL#ixzz1aaFhA05x
We need to do impact litigation for victims.
ChildrenUnlimited@hotmail.com
wanna tell that to all those who laid down their livelihoods and lives in the civil rights and unionization movemsnts? They were tired, scared, and had mouths to feed but they had enough and took the time to do it. If all we're going to do is whine about then we don't deserve to have our family rights movement. Simple as that. Like anything else in life, it's a struggle to get what you want. Sacrifices have to be made. Warmly wanting to go the victimization route is simply recapitulating what the family law industry wants. I think here in Santa Cruz County we need the actual marches and booths etc. And frequently, that's the way it is over here. Can't answer for Santa Clara County/Silicon Valley. It's different.
You want awareness, get in front of the courthouses. Provide the information. Get this to responsible media. The SC Sentinel will not support this but I believe the SJ Mercury will.
George,
If the court had ever wanted to punish you for contempt...they would have by now. They want to punish you alright, but through other means than contempt charges.
As for gaining sympathy for child support debt relief from students with student loan burdens, you might get their symapthy, but it will be difficult to get public sympathy.
The supreme court recently ruled that indigent fathers are not entitled to public defenders before being sentenced, then jailed for child support debt they are unable to pay.
Facts are facts, but it is perception that affects change. Perception is likely to be a group of "deadbeat dads against paying child support", like drunk drivers against mad mothers or something...
I'm on your side guys. Just unsure how you can present the facts in the right sound bites, so that the message is received, and the myths removed.
We want the same but different approaches or ideas. We believe in building national movement and grass roots. That is why we need combine meeting of minds. I have been asking for people to come and help. Santa Clara county has bad history.
I have been talking to many for few years who have been severely impacted by courts. They're withdrawn.
We have to glue in causes and passion at local communities first. Then it will mobilize people to call for action.
There are many divorce sites people commonly writes "No one will help". We will be happy to see any movement to highlight issues.
RE Poster at 10:01,
yes, the perception would very well be DAMM (Drunks Against Mad Mothers) against MADD but that's where the facts/data have to be spelled out very carefully and very clearly.
For example, it's a poorly kept secret that CA's support guidelines were drafted on a sociologist's studies that had falsified data. I can't recall if she was w/Harvard or Stanford, but it was some of her co-workers at Stanford that blew the whistle back in the 90s. She never returned to academia but the guidelines remain.
Another fascinating fact I'm sure we're all aware of is that child support is tax free income to the recipient. And I think we all know support services has carte blanche to impute whatever income you should be making and charge you accordingly.
Since there seems to be so much "free range" and free wheeling in family law, can someone who's more attuned to law than me tell us if family law has some sort of exemption to how other branches of law are bound by the constitution, due process etc, or is it some sort of "common law" that's enshrined in the federal regs to allow broad powers of discretion for the judges, prosecutors, etc? Seems the latter to me.
This is important because then we know the underpinnings of how those people are getting away w/murder. Every branch of law I've seen at least gives the impression of "innocent until proven guilty". Family law is instead under Napoleanic Law, which has as one of it's tenets that the accused (by the state) is guilty until proven innocent. Which of course how Statism works....
Provide me with some food and shelter, as the court has taken everything from me, and I'll consider marching with you, and risk all that I have left...what's left of my freedom and their ability to jail me.
They use the "domestic relations exception" to the constitution in famly law. that's how they get away with it all.
Dear comments of 10:21 AM,
You have good talents, passion and wanting to do greater good.
I read about family courts and have first hand knowledge of its crimes. Every month I learn how evil it is than a what I thought previous month ago about it.
A divorced father himself, Baskerville argues that the image of the deadbeat dad was drawn by those who stood to gain financially, and he identifies by name those he calls “corporate bounty hunters”—most prominently, collection agencies allied with the government.
Robert Williams, for example, went from helping to establish guidelines in the federal Child Support Guidelines Project to founding his own consulting and collection agency. His revenues rose from $9.7 million in 1994 to $21 million in 1996 because of the Clinton administration crackdown on deadbeat dads.
Read more: http://www.touchstonemag.com/archives/article.php?id=21-06-038-b#ixzz1aafFXLRR
Here is one of the stories from many cases of a single parents from Children/ Youth Unlimited Initiative. It gives us tears!
---------------------
I have $7 in pocket and cheked bank account this morning 10/12/11($36 only in it). Employer do not pay in this economy and probably job going away. So I am giving blood for clinical study to make at $4.5/hour to live (they have drawn so much blood) and raises children. Have to wait for next CS check to live. Courts took all our money for litigation, our well-being destroyed but failed to take kids from me. No freedom to choose my career or passion and government controls my divorced life. Career lost and lives destroyed by courts.
Where do you think I would find time to protest. I raise few children and have to work full-time as controlled by courts. I am exhausted and tired. I work 95 hours to meet my demands (care, work, uncooperative ex, courts).
I would commit to do local protests.
------------------------
Heartbreaking stories....
I am scheduled for Watsonville court C at 10:30 am Friday. Because of other cases, the judge may not get to us until close to noon.
re 10:34, the domestic relations exemption (DRE)is not in the Constitution (just read it and the Amendments, maybe I missed it?), but instead was a ruling from SCOTUS in 1859. Digging into the whole DRE issue is a bloody mess. Basically it seems to devolve to the states so any changes have to occur in state legislation. Meaning real guidelines have to be spelled out. Otherwise rulings in individual cases are based on precendent cases and whatever mood the judge is in that day. Mostly the latter I've found.
If I'm wrong on the above conclusion, please let me know, I'm here to learn too as I'm not a lawyer nor that familiar w/the intricacies (and madness) of family law as I know some of you readers are.
As for people who can't march for reasons of sheer poverty and working obscene hours just to stay alive I hear you, not everyone who has good cause can do this, I recognize that. I'm more interested in rousing those who could make something of an effort and have some time to do it. Those who truly can't, you're with us in spirit and your stories and situations help drive those of us who can and will start the family rights campaign. So please keep posting.
I wrote all I know about the domestic relations exception here and here. I think that it is just an excuse to ignore the problem.
you bet it is. Perhaps judges back then were truly wiser knowing not to step into that den of snakes. Today? Hey, lots of money to be made. Actually, though, I believe there was lot more personal responsibility back in those days. People had to mature faster as they didn't live as long, etc. We seem to be prolonging adolescence which is really too bad. But then you can keep people in thrall much easier when you infantilize and victimize them.
About the domestic relations exception...I brought it up here first, but I doubt it's really that important in the overall scheme of how they operate, anyway..
Most of us have read 1000's of pages about what they get away with and how, before ever even running into the DRE issue, and how it could be cited.
My guess is that if some judge is ever pushed enough into feeling the need to explain how he broke constitutional rights, a judge made aware of the DRE can spit it out as an excuse to use, and for anything he did or does.
My other guess is that if you could get rid of the DRE, they'd do whatever they wanted just as they do now...
Ever heard anyone say anything like, " they could never get away with doing all of this if it wasn't for the DRE ?"
Fellows,
We reviewed many cases with different judges. Few judges rejected (denied) DV filings by saying no evidence. Some judges giving TRO, sole custody without any evidence. All filer have to do is to tick mark few in the form and claim an abuse.
Lawyers mention when this happen they call the judge as bad judge or corrupt and TRO/sole custody should not be given. Do any of know what measures should be taken against judge when they issue without any evidence. Obviously, some judges are stamping based which lawyer submitted to them and what gender. What one should do in this circumstance? All this does is to take any rights of defendants and put them in a position when no body hears them or they have to come up with money and time. Judges doing this to give business to their network of lawyers,....
What if many faced the same issue under one judge? Could many file law suit against judge or county by combining multiple victims who faced similar issue?
We have many cases judges badly caught on evidence and destorying families? They went even beyoynd violating and fixing the documents? Lawyers reponses to this - judges's fault. How do we put this judges in jail?
Any thoughts? Thanks
Could anyone wants to help on case analyses if we bring data close to your neighborhood? South-bay, Santa Cruz or other bay areas neighborhoods (peninsula, east bay, SF). Coffee/Tea/simple meals on us. This would take 1-2 hours. This weekend of 10/14 (Fri, Sat, Sun) is open.
We have cases in which lawyers involved from start. But all of them got caught on playing games with healthy family and children. This holy grail case where system got caught on videos, audios, paper and evidence. This shows how far they go to destroy a healthy parents and few children for money.
Please email to ChildrenUnlimited@hotmail.com
The judges, lawyers, dr.s, etc. can be bias, show obvious bad tendencies,
do very suspicious acts, etc..and have no problem getting away with it all, unless there is proof, proof that there was kickbacks, or compensation, payoffs, referreal fees, sorts of things being exchanged that affected outcomes. audio records, video, paper trails.
So, you either have irrefutable evidence vs. them or you have absolutely nothing vs. them.
I could be wrong. This is what I've read a lot. Anyone heard or read differently ?
George ? What's your understanding on this ?
Thanks.
How about filer badly caught on videos, emails, papers? Defrauded courts and lied under oath which all can be proven easily. Found out the filer has secret history of playing these games with a friend who has been playing divorce games for previous 10 years or more.
This has caused harm towards health family and children. Inflicted emotional and psychological pain. Destroyed financially. They keep playing games till date.
Should we call FBI? These are crimes against children and innocent parent to exploit and defraud to gain in courts.
Lawyers and many websites say DAs do not to anything because it is in family law. I spoke to parent who dealt with DAs. Parent mentions useless DAs.
This is goldmine case to highlight how this ex-parte damaged children and innocents. In this case, they're caught badly.
Well you're speaking of something other than proving that court personnel are corrupt. You're speaking of a parent abusing the family law court, causing harm to the children, right ? A parent lying in family court, or what has been referred to as the "palace of perjury" is almost expected behavior.
My guess is that, the court manipulating parent may be turned into c.p.s. because what they are doing is harming the children.
The question, I guess, is, is there no problem that exists, that c.p.s.'s involvement can't make worse for all involved ?
Someone else reading here, might have better opinions and ideas about this.
Look, the judges, evaluators, court mediators can easily say, that "yeah, we get it wrong a lot of times. We're never sure what or who to believe, with a few minutes and a couple of he said she said parents. We're so overburdened, short staffed and innundated, we're forced to make some decisions on what's in the child's best interest, from our gut, or farm it out to evaluators to unearth what might be true or not."
So, there's always going to be a percentage of parents doing harm to the other parent and the children, just like there's always going to be a percentage of the population committing crimes against others.
The worst criminals are a corrupt police force, as they are taking taxpayer money to protect people from crime, while taking money from criminals. And permitting the criminals to commit all the crime the want to commit vs. people, and the more crimes the criminals commit, the more the corrupt police receive.
If you want to protect parents and children from harm, prove the court personnel are corrupt and get them convicted.
Exposing a bad parent to the court or c.p.s. etc..won't really help. These people are busy making money, being paid to look the other way.
Thanks for the insights and observations.
One of the law professors said judges are immoral in addition to lawyers and other in family court. Law professor practiced family law before and professor could not stomach what they are doing in family courts so she/he moved away into corporate world.
We want to highlight cases to show-case atrocities of family law. This is not he said, she said case. Petitioner filed on ex-parte with lies and got caught on emails, paper, videos, audios, witnesses and badly caught. This shows how courts play this game. Judges, lawyers, ... all got caught here. We have all the evidence and times lines. People listen to this evidence and story says 'What the hell!". Is it so easy to play with children and innocent parents? People are heart broken to hear story.
We need to people to help write brochure/flyer for family law causes. We have few individuals who are very good communicators wants to go and distribute flyer downtown to downtown. This flyer directs people to visit "cause oriented web site to protect children and innocents and stop injustices". This builds grass-root fabric to mobilize people to take actions/protests. We have many innovative programs to draw attention.
We could walk and have conversations with 20-40 people per hour during peak times and handout brochure/flyer. Awake many while doing this. We have lots of traction. Strangers wants to do some. But many ask us if it is a non-profit company.
More than 200 people applied for voluntary positions and paid positions. They all wanted to work and promote but wanted to do it under non-profit company.
We want to actively engage now. If anyone wants to help, let's start dialogue at childrenUnlimited@hotmail.com
To me, a protest is a nice effort.
Obtain irrefutable evidence of bribery, kickbacks, etc. ?..you then eliminate someone or persons, and spare 100's or 1000's of people suffering and injustices for years to come, and discourage others who may be doing the same orconsidering it.
Gather strong evidence that will produce convictions.
Build it, they will arrive to protest and help.
An anonymous donor has offered a $100,000 reward for the return of a missing Kansas City baby
Published October 14, 2011
Associated Press
KANSAS CITY, Mo. – An anonymous donor has offered a $100,000 reward for the return of a missing Kansas City baby or information that leads to the conviction of anyone involved in her disappearance, according to a security consultant who says the donor also hired him to get involved in the case.
....
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/14/missouri-police-continue-search-for-missing-11-month-old-girl/?test=latestnews#ixzz1aoOogev9
Build it, they will arrive to protest and help.
An anonymous donor has offered a $100,000 reward for the return of a missing Kansas City baby
Published October 14, 2011
Associated Press
KANSAS CITY, Mo. – An anonymous donor has offered a $100,000 reward for the return of a missing Kansas City baby or information that leads to the conviction of anyone involved in her disappearance, according to a security consultant who says the donor also hired him to get involved in the case.
....
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/10/14/missouri-police-continue-search-for-missing-11-month-old-girl/?test=latestnews#ixzz1aoOogev9
7:06 PM
Build it, they will arrive to protest and help.
An anonymous donor has offered a $100,000 reward for the return of a missing Kansas City baby
Published October 14, 2011
Associated Press
KANSAS CITY, Mo. – An anonymous donor has offered a $100,000 reward for the return of a missing Kansas City baby or information that leads to the conviction of anyone involved in her disappearance, according to a security consultant who says the donor also hired him to get involved in the case.
.....
They may arrive to protest that parents are being treated as guilty until proven innocent which is what's going on.
But is it the consequence of incompetence, lack of resources and or parents manipulation of the courts, or a combination, or the unfortunate need to protect children to error on the side of caution, but rather corruption and greed..without any proof,the protestors will be protesting against the court officials based on the presumption of guilt vs. the presumption of innocence, too.
For 50 years f.b.i. director J Edgar Hoover insisted that there was no such thing as organized crime in the u.s., and nothing was done about it, till R.F.K. decided he wanted to prove it existed, and eliminate it.
It was simple, fast and easy for Kennedy to do, too.
There are what, a total of about 700 congressman, senators and governors in the u.s. ? Name one that is doing anything about reforming the family law courts.
Now, cops like Serpico, brought down the N.y.police dept. himself..Karen Silkwood and many others affected massive reform...
They all did it not with protests, but by coming up with some proof..
Come up with some proof, and they politicians will jump all over it !
RE poster at 9:04, that's exactly right: get the data, get the evidence. Lots of it. Then get it out in the public. I still think a protest/march airing those findings would be a good way to go because the local papers/media (in Santa Cruz) won't publish it otherwise.
Spend your energy on getting the evidence,. Turn the evidence into the authorities. The authorities will get the convictions. The media will publicize the convictions.
The authorities will pursue more convictions, especially if provided more evidence. They may begin sting operations, too.
The media, publicizing the convictions and should compel politicians to legislate reform.
Why would you devote effort towards protests before you have evidence, or the evidence doesn't produce the convictions, or the media doesn't publicize the convictions, or the politicians don't respond to what's in the media ?
In other words, first things first. Obtain the evidence.
Remember, for years protesters protested vs. Nixon for 4 years, and the result was his landslide re election in 1972...
Wordward and Berstein, revealed evidence of watergate, and Nixon was gone in just months !
yes, notice it was Woodward and Bernstein who published it in the paper, then, and only then did the authorities go for it.
Knowing the DA and sheriff's dept in this county you can be quite sure they won't do diddly-squat, got to get it in the media first.
Agreed, protests/marches w/o evidence is a waste of time. Get the data and get it out there. Protests are one way to get the media's attention. Just handing the data to a reporter will likely go nowhere fast.
Don't agree with you . Sorry.
You're telling me that if you were to fax photos, video tapes, emails, bank records, etc, to newspaper reporters of a family court judge or court evaluator or mediator,lawyer, etc receiving or giving out bribes, the reporters are just going to ignore that sort of huge story that they dream about getting headline stories with ?
And, you think the f.b.i. is going to ignore this same submitted evidence and do nothing also ?
And if the f.b.i. fed atorney's etc. ignore it, and you then submit it to the newspapers, too, and add that it was ignored by the feds./authorities the media will ignore that, too. ?
Now, you're suggesting that groups of protesters with no evidence might be able to gain support and attention ? Or if these protesters were to hand out the evidence in the form of flyers, then the people receiving the flyers will act on it effectively ?
Finally, it was Woodward and Bernstien who published it... the reporters who did it right ? Did Woodward and Bernstein seek out the evidence ? Did they find or stumble accross the evidence and then publish it ? Or did DEEP THROAT contact Woodward and Bernstien and it was a citizen, presenting evidence to a reporter that actually wqas responsible for bringing down Nixon's reign and abuse of government power and corruption ?
Yes, there's some politics involved here. Some feminism, sure, But you're not going to affect change focusing on those aspects. Focus on the greed and corruption. Get the proof and evidence, and you'll get the reforming wheels in motion.
Certainly good observations and deep thought comments posted here
-------------------
Re: 11:26 AM....
Spend your energy on getting the evidence,. Turn the evidence into the authorities. The authorities will get the convictions. The media will publicize the convictions.....
The authorities will pursue more convictions, especially if provided more evidence. They may begin sting operations, too....
REPLY:
-------
Wait a minute, for few years I heard they (authorities, DAs) do not touch family law cases even when evidence is there. I talked to a parent who runs website for injustices against family courts. Parent mention it is almost useless to talk to DAs even you have evidence and perjuries.
Lawyers informed the same that DAs won't do any. Lawyers went beyond said in history for 30 years almost no one got into trouble under perjury and lying to courts. In addition, they laugh that lawyers lie most of the time and even under declaration which they sign under oath.
I understand to highlight a good story with evidence for media. But what I learned about family courts and DAs that they ignore all that.
Are there other alternatives? Like class action or group of victims could file lawsuits for abusing innocent parents and harming children under this system?
Thanks
I would not call Deep Throat a "citizen". He was the Associate Director of the FBI, and he had a personal grudge against Nixon. He illegally leaked info from FBI investigations in order to get revenge on Nixon.
I am not sure how this relates to us, unless we can get some allies at the top of law enforcement agencies.
George,
You're right about deep throat, but laugh with me,for a second here, man, because in family court lingo,
"that doesn't mean he can't be called a citizen ."
This is how it relates,..you referenced one woman getting her child back, and an official being busted a few months ago. The mother did it by using a hidden tape recorder. Remember ? She had no special law enforcement connections.
If you research, you'll find that while they are few and far between, such sorts of attempts have been successful and executed by ordinary folks like us.
Certainly good observations and deep thought comments posted here
-------------------
Re: 11:26 AM....
Spend your energy on getting the evidence,. Turn the evidence into the authorities. The authorities will get the convictions. The media will publicize the convictions.....
The authorities will pursue more convictions, especially if provided more evidence. They may begin sting operations, too....
REPLY:
-------
Wait a minute, for few years I heard they (authorities, DAs) do not touch family law cases even when evidence is there. I talked to a parent who runs website for injustices against family courts. Parent mention it is almost useless to talk to DAs even you have evidence and perjuries.
Lawyers informed the same that DAs won't do any. Lawyers went beyond said in history for 30 years almost no one got into trouble under perjury and lying to courts. In addition, they laugh that lawyers lie most of the time and even under declaration which they sign under oath.
I understand to highlight a good story with evidence for media. But what I learned about family courts and DAs that they ignore all that.
Are there other alternatives? Like class action or group of victims could file lawsuits for abusing innocent parents and harming children under this system?
ok. if I could do one thing I think it would be to convince Michael Moore to make a movie about family law court...
His first and only movie in which there's no need to distort or exaggerate anything.
Is there an idea in what I'm saying here somewhere ?
Certainly good observations and deep thought comments posted here
-------------------
Re: 11:26 AM comments...
Spend your energy on getting the evidence,.Turn the evidence into the authorities. The authorities will get the convictions. The media will publicize the convictions.....
The authorities will pursue more convictions, especially if provided more evidence. They may begin sting operations, too....
REPLY:
-------
Wait a minute, for few years I heard they (authorities, DAs) do not touch family law cases even when evidence is there. I talked to a parent who runs website for injustices against family courts. Parent mention it is almost useless to talk to DAs even you have evidence and perjuries.
Lawyers informed the same that DAs won't do any. Lawyers went beyond said in history for 30 years almost no one got into trouble under perjury and lying to courts. In addition, they laugh that lawyers lie most of the time and even under declaration which they sign under oath.
I understand to highlight a good story with evidence for media. But what I learned about family courts and DAs that they ignore all that.
Are there other alternatives? Like class action or group of victims could file lawsuits for abusing innocent parents and harming children under this system?
Thanks
Michael Moore or perhaps the guy who did "Superzize Me" would actually be a good idea.
Pardon my cynicism about reporters and authorities. But notice the real perps of the current Depression aren't getting prosecuted, only sacrificial red herrings. And I don't see much in the way of mainstream media really going after the cause of the current financial situation.
My personal experience w/the local Santa Cruz news is that they won't really touch anything critical of the status quo running things here. I've pinged them about CPS etc and have gotten zero response. This is a corrupt little town. And I don't believe that's unique to here.
I'm not knocking what you're saying: get the hard data and evidence to the media, I'm just skeptical of any real action. Do I support what you're proposing? You bet. Better than not trying all your options and believe me, I would love for you to prove me wrong and welcome it. We want the same thing.
I contacted a guy 9 months ago who was editor in history channel. I requested him we like to see documentary from Michael Moore, like super size me or Food nation (or Food inc) to do film on family courts.
Hope people will push to do this.
Certainly good observations and deep thought comments posted here
Re: 11:26 AM....
Spend your energy on getting the evidence,. Turn the evidence into the authorities. The authorities will get the convictions. The media will publicize the convictions.....
The authorities will pursue more convictions, especially if provided more evidence. They may begin sting operations, too....
REPLY:
-------
Wait a minute, for few years I heard they (authorities, DAs) do not touch family law cases even when evidence is there. I talked to a parent who runs website for injustices against family courts. Parent mention it is almost useless to talk to DAs even you have evidence and perjuries.
Lawyers informed the same that DAs won't do any. Lawyers went beyond said in history for 30 years almost no one got into trouble under perjury and lying to courts. In addition, they laugh that lawyers lie most of the time and even under declaration which they sign under oath.
I understand to highlight a good story with evidence for media. But what I learned about family courts and DAs that they ignore all that.
Are there other alternatives? Like class action or group of victims could file lawsuits for abusing innocent parents and harming children under this system?
Thanks
Certainly good observations and deep thought comments posted here
Re: 11:26 AM....
...Turn the evidence into the authorities. The authorities will get the convictions. The media will publicize the convictions.....
REPLY:
-------
Wait a minute, for few years I heard they (authorities, DAs) do not touch family law cases even when evidence is there. I talked to a parent who runs website for injustices against family courts. Parent mention it is almost useless to talk to DAs even you have evidence and perjuries.
Lawyers informed the same that DAs won't do any. Lawyers went beyond said in history for 30 years almost no one got into trouble under perjury and lying to courts. In addition, they laugh that lawyers lie most of the time and even under declaration which they sign under oath.
I understand to highlight a good story with evidence for media. But what I learned about family courts and DAs that they ignore all that.
Are there other alternatives? Like class action or group of victims could file lawsuits for abusing innocent parents and harming children under this system?
yeah we want the same thing ! I don't know about the newspapers, but i believe you. I'm just running anything up the pole that comes to mind. I'm not interested in proving myself right about anything or someone else wrong about anything...I want US to be right about something and be effective.
Michael Moore is a proclaimed libertarian. Our issue here is right up his alley, isn't it ? We're not coming from the left or coming from the right, here, and maybe that legitimizes the effort and could help gain support for it, if it can be exposed through the right medium.
What did Moore spend on Roger and Me ? Maybe you need a camera guy a microphone, and an interviewer stopping anyone and everyone walking out of the family courthouse and getting them explaining whatever they just did in there or whatever just happened to them ? Parents, lawyers, mediators, evaluators, etc.. anyone who'll open their mouth about anything..
And you film all of those who run from the interviewer and what that demonstrates in contrast ?
I hope we as a group, me included, don't just end up continually preaching to our chior.
10 years ago, I'd have signed a petition to save the spotted owl, right away, and walked right past the guy with a petition for dads to get out of paying child support and complaining about the bad shake they got in family court.. couldn't have believed it...
But, had I seen an M. Moore movie about the dads, the next day, I'd have sought out the guy with the petition about family courts abuse and signed it twice !!!
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