Dirty secret No. 1 in Obamacare is about the government's coming into homes and usurping parental rights over child care and development.These govt agents will not be "well-trained and competent", and they will not be just providing knowledge. They will have their own personal biases, and they will have ideology-based instructions to change peoples' behavior. And they will be threatening to take your kids away from parents who do not comply.
It's outlined in sections 440 and 1904 of the House bill (Page 838), under the heading "home visitation programs for families with young children and families expecting children." The programs (provided via grants to states) would educate parents on child behavior and parenting skills.
The bill says that the government agents, "well-trained and competent staff," would "provide parents with knowledge of age-appropriate child development in cognitive, language, social, emotional, and motor domains ... modeling, consulting, and coaching on parenting practices," and "skills to interact with their child to enhance age-appropriate development."
Are you kidding me?! With whose parental principles and values? Their own? Certain experts'? From what field and theory of childhood development? As if there are one-size-fits-all parenting techniques! Do we really believe they would contextualize and personalize every form of parenting in their education, or would they merely universally indoctrinate with their own?
Tuesday, August 11, 2009
Obama healthcare usurps parental rights
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26 comments:
a couple of things to consider in all this. First, there's a variety of bills running around both the house and senate and they've not been consolidated yet, so no doubt lots of horsetrading's still in the works. Secondly, I would be curious to understand more clearly what the context of these "home visits" is envisioned: all expectant parents? All parents w/kids under a certain age? Only those parents under the thumb of the family law system? Thirdly, and most importantly, if we as disenfranchised divorced dads wanted to fight this sort of language, then we'd have to do it the only way things get done in politics anymore: as a serious organized lobby group with "teeth". Just like the women's rights groups, just like the various lawyer groups, just like the social workers and psych industry groups, health insurance, AMA, etc ad nauseum. So guys, there's how many million of us out there in all walks of life, work, skills, talents, and motivation. What's stopping us? This is just like the early days of the civil rights movement (50s). We can't do this any other way now, the mainstream media is biased against us, coloring us a knuckle-dragging uber right wing neanderthals, the likes of Glenn Sacks, w/all due respect to those of you who like and agree with him, doesn't help. The hearts and minds of the general population have to be reached and reasoned with. Sounds like the Marxist teachings that supposedly informed Hillary and Obama? So be it: use what works. We have to be heard over the likes of Oprah, and unfortunately even the President w/his very unfortunate and misguided Father's Day message to dads. The Women's Movement is for a women uber alles system. It has to be countered in the same way using the same tools they've used to get where they are. I don't want to see women as lesser than men in any way. But I don't want to see men lesser than women, either, and that's what's happening with the usurption of the male in the family.
Any thoughts how to make a movement like this? I see the beginnings here and there, even that father's group in DC, but no critical mass yet. Why?
The South County Kid
Yes, this is just one small aspect of the health care bill. There are many bigger issues at stake, and I wasn't commenting on those. Just the attack on parental rights.
I wish I knew how divorced dads could have more influence. I do think that Glenn Sacks is doing good job. We need more activists.
I got you were commenting on just this aspect of the health care bill(s), no worries. What my point is whether or not this is for real, and what the parameters are for this particular aspect of that/those bills. Again, is this going to be mandated for all expectant parents or ?? Would like more detail if possible. It disgusts me when congress trojan horses stuff like this in a complex bill, this has nothing to do w/real reform in healthcare delivery in this country. If this part of the bill is as presented, woe unto all of us as a country and culture.
I would disagree re your comments on Glenn Sacks, he lacks credibility in a lot of circles outside the more conservative ones, I don't take him seriously at all in almost everything he says, and I respect the intelligent conservative commentators/thinkers, the few that remain, anyway, takes two wings to fly after all. The problem is that while his message on the encroachment of father's rights is correct, it's tainted w/the rest of his rhetoric on other matters, he comes across as a lowbrow rabble-rouser not unlike Limbaugh. Activists in father's rights are going to have to be more "on message" with just that and leave out either left or right wing political biases if this movement is to be taken seriously in as many walks of life in this country as possible. Start slinging "Marxist!" or "Flyover!" epitaths at folks and their opinions, then one is going to derail the whole thing. That's how Rove et al was able to do the divide and conquer so well in the 2000 and 2004 elections. Wedge via Nixonian class, and thus political distinction, us vs them, it's dirty stuff, but that's now the norm from both the left and right in politics. Yes, this is a social issue, but it has many political and legal ramifications that have to be dealt w/and addressed. Who or where is our Poster Boy for the disenfranchised father that will sell? Our Martin Luther King Jr all can look up to as legitimately aggrieved, above reproach, and sympathetically viewed by the country at large who is working w/the system, not against it in a reasonable manner? It isn't Brother Baldwin, alas, I think he tried but he doesn't seem to "sell" for reasons I don't fathom. Nor Glenn. Facts don't seem to matter so much anymore, it's all knee jerk emotional uproar in the media, at least to get one's attention. Then get the facts right and deliver them in an indisputable, yet digestible manner and you've got something to work w/to get the dialog going on a national level. Your website is also very helpful, but it needs to reach a larger audience, hard to do when people are so biased on this issue and won't listen to opposing views. Not saying you don't, but most folks don't seem to bother.
The South County Kid
Anyone wanna take a guess that the above poster is a Liberal? Wow, talk about being one-dimensional.
You bet I am, though I'm more centrist than you give me credit for: I've started a few high tech companies, so I "get" capitalism just fine, thank you. Takes two wings to fly, btw. Unfortunately I don't see much in the way of intelligence or answers to current problems coming out of the right wing these days. Conservatives have lost credibility in the areas of where they were best in: fiscal matters and smaller government, esp in matters of interfering with people's lives. They lost both of those back in the days of Reagan. While I'm a so-called "liberal", I detest the far left's efforts to inject pseudoscience in controlling families. My "liberalism" is based on people being able to live their lives as they see fit, regardless if it's conservatively religious based to living in communes. I believe people should be given a break somehow, someway when their luck is down because capitalism as practiced in this country exhibits the worst traits of that system. But the lines where that support come into play must be very clear and very limited. We can't afford it either fiscally nor culturally. One dimensional? So, tell me what you propose to actually solve the problem we have, Einstein. Tea Bag Parties? Please...... Use your head, get past the culture wars, learn from history, and start thinking about the real problem.
The South County Kid
And if you think Liberalism or any type of political movement is the answer to serious problems you watch waaaaayyyy too much TV junior. I love how you Libs have this im holier than thou chip on your shoulder. No one accused you of being a failure, no one accused you of being poor. So why on Earth do you throw out the "high-tech companies you own" line so fast? Good for you, now stick to the subject.
I propose we use real solutions to our problems and stop lying to ourselves with thinkings like ...nothing is wrong with CPS, illegal immigration is fine and doesnt have any cost or burden, poor people will be inspired with more handouts, letting underqualified people be in positions of authority based on race or gender has no consequences, etc. Once we can get past these myths and lies the commie Left feeds us daily we can start to make real progress.
commie left? WTF? This isn't the 50s anymore sport, communism is dead in most of the world. And what would you know about it, anyway, other than what Limbaugh or some other knuckle-dragging demagogue tells you? I actually know a lot about communism, my dad and a lot of his family escaped from a communist country. I still have family left behind there. Yes, there's still a couple left, unfortunately, I'm sure you can narrow it down which one they come from. Been there, too and seen first hand what that does to a society, as well as a family. So spare me the leftist=commie crap, you know not what you're talking about.
As for my holier than thou chip on my shoulders about my companies, are you pulling some prole whining crap or what? I mention that in the hopes that those readers of this little blog who are of the far right, and there seems to be quite a bit of it in this movement, know that there are folks who are on the other side of the political aisle and maybe even socioeconomic setting that are in the same boat as them. Together we can win, divided by ignorance and intolerance isn't going to help. BTW, I don't own the companies anymore thanks to the family law crap and Wall St shenanigans. You obvioualy have misread my intentions in sharing my background, pity, there was no ego intended, nor do I look down my nose at other folks. Nothing wrong w/being proud of what you do, regardless if it being a janitor, farmer, surgeon, or CEO, I hope you're proud of your work as well.
So the political movement or process isn't going to work? What do you suggest, armed insurrection like some pinhead militia group? Not for me, pal, point that at someone else. I floated a modest idea of fighting fire w/fire, using the media and the political process to do something constructive. Other than your ranting about commie lies, what are you suggesting? Your move, Einstein, let's hear what you really think we should do.
btw, you may indeed accuse me of being poor. Thanks to the family law system and community property laws here in sunny CA, I had to give away half of what I made (I was the breadwinner, btw, she a stay-home mom w/an MBA). That's fine, I'm not greedy and hated the furniture anyway. The problem is then that the laws here in CA are that if you lose custody of your kids, a common tactic here in Santa Cruz County, is that your income is docked for support at a fixed (high) rate of your income, and your income only, hers is irrelevant in the equation. George, the host of this blog is only one of a few dads I've met here who underwent the same thing. I'll bet that's true with a lot of you dads reading this as well. Savings? Gone, to pay the exorbinant legal fees that did me no good, but certainly stimulated economically the local legal community. Still can't even send my kids a birthday card due to restraining orders still in effect for one more year. Communism? This, my friend, is totalitarianism, screw the political labels of fascism or communism or whatever other dead horse you want to flog. BTW, if you studied your political history, you know both fascism and communism are at heart both stateism, just from different ends of the poltical spectrum, where they meet in an unholy philosophical agreement. Oh, and due to the current economic situation, I'm unemployed, can't start up another company and can't even find consulting work in my field. I even tried carpentry, cooking, anything else, I'm fairly handy. I have a lot of company, though. I see them all the time at the child support hearings being haraunged by judges and DCSS attorneys who have tenured jobs at the rate of at least $110K/y. Again, paid for by our tax dollars. So, I guess you can accuse of being unsuccessful as well, pal. Enjoy.
Bwahaha, you arrorgant little brat, you need to be put over someones knee and spanked. Spank the "two high-tech companies you own right outta you".
1. Communism/Marxism is alive and well throughout the world. In fact, its probably stronger now than it has ever been. Russia has been pleading with the US to not go down the path we are going. If you research this you will see many of the things Government is doing now completely resemble what the Russians did in the early 20th Century. Most Western European nations and nearly all Eastern European nations have turned to socialism/marxism. You simply haven't done your homework and bought into that...well, the USSR is no longer (which it is, its Presidents are all ex-KGB) so Communism must be dead line. Clinton, Obama, Pelosi, Biden, are all devout Marxist and were trained by Radical Marxist. Obama even credits the book, "rules for radicals" as his inspiration.
2. Ahh yes, you love throwing Limbaughs name around don't you? Just like all the other Libs. Truth is, is that he's barely made a peep in 10 years. He has a little radio show at some crazy hour on AM band that only farmers and HAM radio enthusiast listen to. The Libs need boogeymen. Rove, Limbaugh, Gingrich, Bush, Palin. They take peoples minds away from the policies. But now, all the boogeymen are gone and retired (even Palin). So now, they attack its people. Tea-baggers, birthers, townies. Even when it became too difficult to attack Ron Paul they started to refer to his followers as "Ron Nuts". This is what is known as pork. As they say in Missouri....show me. Weak-minded fools like you however buy into this nonsense word for word.
3. I am proud of my work. I...am....proud....of...it. That doesn't mean I'm gonna brag about how much money I have as some sort of chip that makes my statements somehow have more merit. E.G. I make good money, so obviously I know a lot....stupid, and patronizing.
4. "I floated a modest idea of fighting fire w/fire, using the media and the political process to do something constructive." ...Ahhh, if that's not a Marxist quote I dont know what is. It's that "modest idea" that got us into this mess in the first place. Politics and social movements are nothing more than getting the meek to buy into your ideology (Horseshit) under the guise that making them more powerful will help the little guy. Nothing more, nothing less. Or, as someone once put it..."it's show business for ugly people". I prefer to look back at things from a mediator stand-point. I watch the elite spew their lies, and I watch the little guy fight over which to gobble up. Once you look at things like that, it becomes more clearer. I actually made money in the stock market like that. Never looked at charts, profits, P/E, just watched the scams.
P.S, I do actually have a genius IQ. So, the Einstein comment is kinda fitting. Thank You.
Nobody accused you of being poor or a failure, you know that. I was making fun of you for being so quick to throw your resume and success around without prompting. You know that as well.
As far as what happened to you and George I sympathize with you. I have many friends in the same boat. The problem is those guys are all Liberals to and got mad at me when I told them the dark side about being married. Funny, but they still do. I guess misery does love company.
I still contend that Feminism is the biggest reason you and George are in this situation. They were fronted the money by Marxist groups (Betty Friedan)anyone. Sure, it's easy to hate the CPS, and JJJ, but they are just trained monkeys. They have Judges conventions were they openly discuss destroying Fathers and breaking up families. The ones who follow get promoted and get to keep their comfy job. The ones that resist, like the Judge in Georgia who temporarily overruled IMBRA quickly find out the full wrath of what a group of angry Lesbians with false victimhood and huge bank acocunt courtesy of Uncle Sam can do to you.
Once you find out exactly who the true enemy is, then you can begin a counter-attack. And trust me, it's more than just Rush Limbaugh.
There is plenty of blame for both right-wingers and left-wingers. They have all contributed to our family court situation. Rush Limbaugh hasn't said anything about the issue, as far as I know.
My post above is about the govt sending social workers into peoples' homes to tell them how to rear their kids. My impression is that it is mostly left-wingers who want to do that.
Well George, give it a few minutes and I'm sure someone can find a way to blame Glenn Beck for it.
George, I think you're right, no argument.
As for the Anonymous poster I've been sparring with, check your meds, dude. Easy to be an asshole when you're separated by the distance and anonymity of cyberspace, eh? Bet you wouldn't have the balls to say any of that to me in person. You sound ultimately like a bully, and thus a coward. As for your genius IQ, couldn't tell by your postings. I have one, too. So what? Believe me? I don't really care. Wanna compare "size" next? Spare me.
But I appreciate your sympathy to George's and my plight. Yes, feminism did have a lot to do with it, but also the worst of human nature. And you just exhibited some of that. If you're the kind of person involved in this father's rights movement, we're doomed.
You never addressed the fundamental question, which tells me you have nothing further to offer in the way of intelligent dialectic. Don't bother responding to this, I won't reply, you are not worth further time, you are obviously delusional. And not interested in doing something positive to change this mess. Communism, like I said, what the fck do you really know about it, pal?
Ahhhh, now I take Meds and am a bully. Sigh.......boy, you Libs. Townie, birther, Ron Nut, take your meds.....don't you people ever get embarrassed listening to yourselves? When I lived in SW Detroit, west Phoenix and South Dallas, I never saw you liberals there for some reason. Hummm, maybe you're making the world a better place from afar.
Actually, I would have zero doubt, or fear saying these things to your face. I have said them to many peoples faces. I have spoken my mind always, as a citizen, as a soldier, as an employee. Sometimes it has costs me. But I am not broken like you and George are. You two would laugh at me, but it is I who has an intact soul. I've never had the state control me, I've never had to kiss ass to a professor or an employer, or change my opinions about anything. My soul is intact. And I didn't even need to own a couple high-tech companies in Silicon Valley to do it either. I am the pinnacle of freedom, you should pay attention to me more and you could have the same.
BTW, telling someone to "don't bother responding to this" means, you have yielded. Like I figured you would. And telling someone they would never say something to you personally is a form of bullying. So, by you calling me a bully while you were bullying is Chutzpah to say the least. You are a child, I could tell that from your first sentence. What is that signature again.....the south side kid or something cheesy like that. Oh brother......nothing more needs to be said at that point.
OK, I'll bite. I'm simply letting a fool have the last word, if you think that's "winning" and argument, then by all means enjoy your so-called victory. Think you have me figured out? You know nothing about me. There's nothing else that needs to be said. Be at peace, I don't hate you, I'm not angry with you, I simply pity you. You simply snarl at what's wrong and do nothing to help to solve things.
BTW, I did notice you saying you served in the military. So, did you see actual combat? Vietnam? Korea? WWII? Gulf War(s)? If so, I feel for you having experienced that. I have no idea what that does to people other than what I've seen from family and friends who were in combat and it's harsher than I can even imagine. In that case I respectfully yield to your tirade and leave it be, you have a licence as far as I'm concerned, call me whatever you like.
On the otherhand, if you're like my former father in law, a Marine officer who served, but between Korea and Vietnam and stayed stateside (like brave little Rummy, but at least he served before screwing up the DoD), then there's little excuse for your shitty attitude. My former father in law is a "macho man" and yet let every woman in his life castrate him, starting w/his mother and continuing to my ex. And also a big resentful hater who ultimately did nothing w/his life and saw "commies in every closet". And a white supremist to boot. Immigrants that aren't northern european descent? Deport them, that's not what a REAL amurican is. Uh huh. A grade school history teacher, wonder how many kids he fucked up, he was ultimately fired from the school district, if memory serves.
So I can tell my having started a couple of companies sticks in your craw. You can't let go of it. Again, if you could read, you'd see my explanation, but obviously it didn't register. And yes, "Libs" like me do like capitalism, it's been pretty good to me and my family. That's part of why I trotted that out so you can it's not just "conservatives" that are pro-capitalism and want less intrusive govt.
Chill, hater. You won't live much longer w/that much anger in your head and heart. Seen too many of you guys in the ER w/aneurysms and heart attacks, believe me, please, if only for your own sake.
Peace.
damn me for a fool, this is too good to pass up. Just a stupid college kid at heart still after 50 years on this planet. You never had the state control you? Idiot, you served in the military. Doesn't get more controlled by the state than that, you answered to the President, the Pentagon, and the rest of the chain of command. They tell you get in harm's way w/a gun, you say "Yes Sir" and do it. With no recourse. I know, I worked w/USAMMRA for several years in combat casualty research, so I got to work w/a Ranger officer w/a PhD in physiology (interesting mix, but an interesting guy). A bad-ass mofo and sharper'n hell and a great guy to have a beer with. He was in the first Gulf War as well as Mogadishu and saw lots of combat. Then our project was cancelled thanks to 9-11 (bullets, not bandages was the priority) and he was reinstated for combat duty and went to Afghanistan. Thankfully I heard he's still OK. Also worked w/a female Col MD officer (same project) who was shot down in Mogadishu in a helicopter, was captured and raped. And oddly enough, neither of them w/bitterness or crappy attitude like you. I'm sorry to dig at you like this, but you are really messed up and delusional, George and I are broken and we need to look up to you? No, I look up to those guys and my family and friends that got shot in combat, or worse, not a hater that obviously doesn't really know what he's talking about. So you lived in tough parts of cities? Sorry 'bout that. We all have some cross to bear I guess. Detroit is an incredible music town, though: RnB, classical, jazz, rock and on and on. You like music? I'm not broken (nor is George), I may be down on luck these days, but my music is only better because of it.
Have you been drinking?
I think both you have been, whoever you are. This dialog is completely out of line on a blog about family law issues. The only topic either of you brought up is the IMBRA court case, which I haven't heard about. Take your bar room fight somewhere else and let the rest of us talk about the courts.
Hi, yeah, we should number these post. I am responsible for post #4 #6, #9, #10, #12, #14, #18, and this one.
As far as the IMBRA case goes. This small Georgia county had an IMBRA lawsuit claiming it was unconstitutional (which it is). This judge who we can assume is tucked away in rural Georgia and not in the hip world of making it illegal to talk to a women from overseas without a background check was shocked and ruled it unconstituational. The big feminist groups ran down there and after several "meetings" with this judge, they made it clear to him who was in charge and he quickly reversed his decision.
I would have held my ground. But as I said earlier, my soul is intact.
thanks for the information on the IMBRA case, as well as toning it down. Do you know when that was and was there any news coverage on it?
I don't what happened here, you both were making some interesting points, and then a lot of name calling that just wasn't appropriate, I'm surprised the guy running this blog didn't shut you guys down. The other guy sounds like he had a lot of skin in the family law game, I hope he's OK. These are hard times right now for a lot of people and tempers are flying. Glad my divorce was a long time ago and went well, it seems much harder and meaner now.
Umm, no offense to George, but this blog did need a little life. As far as IMBRA, that happened a few years ago and that website no longer exists. However, here is a site that gets pretty detailed about that Judge and the state of Georgia's Supreme Court decision on it. It pretty much has everything you need to know.
http://www.online-dating-rights.com/forum/index.php?topic=1221.0
so what's next, Match.com? I hope my son doesn't use any of those dating websites. Thanks for the information.
Btw, I have a pretty good idea now who your bar room brawl buddy is, that Army combat casualty research world is small and not too many people fit his profile, if what he says is true. If it's who I think it is, he did some amazing work and saved a lot of lives, but was put through the ringer from what I heard. Pity you guys couldn't get along, you both have some good ideas and a good guy got slagged for the sake of livening up a small blogsite.
communism with ideological mind control is in our future and part of that is the destruction of men as breadwinners and the rightful leaders of the family. But we will follow the example of China and be crypto-capitalist and only a few select members in the party will profit. The rest of us will be enslaved between credit ratings, high taxes, government run healthcare, high energy costs (funding the very islamofascists trying to kill us) and high rents in slums owned by the few wealthy through bank foreclosures. You will not be able to make enough at your service industry job to meet your living costs and pay taxes because your higher paying job was outsourced to a 3rd world country for pennies on the dollar wages there. You will not be able to have a family unless you meet the commie-feminist criteria of the local committees in charge of family affairs. It's too perfect a set up. And it's happening RIGHT NOW! And it will all be run from Wall St, where the oligarchs live. Wake up America!
I don't know if the above post is a mocking post or a serious one, but I can tell you that most of that is already true.
Ummm, I just read that one post that starts...."damn me a fool"
1. I voluntarily joined the military and knew all the risk involved. I could have voluntarily left it as well (yes, it's pretty much was that simple back in the early 90's). I wasn't subject to having family and friends torn away from me cuz of some judges bad day, I had a set time of service contract. Hardly the same thing moron. Know anyone who would re-enlist for divorce proceedings?
2. I was at and attended every single chopper crash in Mogadishu minus 1 till 1994. All pilots were either killed or immediately rescued with the exception of Pilot Durant, who was released bout 2 weeks later. Never heard the story you are telling. Also, why are you bragging cuz you "know" someone who had that happen to them. That's like bragging about Mickey Mantles left-handed homeruns. I have/had no problem saying the phrase "Yes Sir". It's a sign of respect and I still use it with my Father. Who was home everyday at 4pm when I was a child....hint....hint.
3. Because I have different opinions about things, I am somehow "bitter" about my military days? Incredibly stupid. Also, you can only look up to soldiers who were wounded? Stupid again, guess people who were guick on their feet just aren't as enlightening, eh?
4. I love music and just yesterday went to the Motown Museum on what's now Berry Gordy Jr street for the umpteenth time.
5. The statement that I live/d in bad neighborhoods is by no means an attempt to garner sympathy or obtain street cred points. The point is ,is that elitist liberals are always so quick to decide what's best for people who live in those neighborhoods while never actually living in them themselves. As far as Im concered, it's mearly just an attempt to keep people in those neighborhoods forever under the guise of empowerment. In fact, they even call this neighborhood an 'Empowerment Zone", now that I think about it.
6. Yes, you and George are broken. That's why we are here, to try and spread the word so other men won't end up broken as well.
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